The Defenders

Scott Hardie | August 20, 2017
Is anybody else watching the big Marvel/Netflix crossover series? They've only been setting it up for something like three years now. I just finished watching it, so spoilers ahead.

Mostly I really enjoyed it -- enough to binge-watch the series in one weekend anyway, which is super-rare for me. It absolutely fixed some of the big problems with the other Marvel/Netflix shows, namely slack pacing, circular plotting, and lack of resolution/payoff. Too many of the other shows, especially Iron Fist, felt like they were treading water for multiple episodes at a time without having the plot move forward, but this one doesn't have time to waste. By trimming the series to eight episodes instead of thirteen, it really felt like it had strong narrative momentum, reminiscent of how Lost picked up a ton of speed in its latter seasons by halving the episode count.

But Defenders also has some of the weaknesses of its predecessors, namely unintelliglble action scenes set in near-darkness, an overindulgence in martial arts to the exclusion of other kinds of action, interesting villains dying too early, and Danny Rand. Is he the worst or what? So hot-headed, impulsive, and just plain stupid. He spends an entire episode fighting with his friends and getting tied up because he wants to go off alone to fight the Hand and they know that the Hand will trick him into using his powers to break a seal -- and then he winds up next to the seal and he uses his powers. I have a hard time rooting for a protagonist who is the dumbest character across five separate shows.

i really enjoyed the banter and interplay between the heroes, which should be one of the highlights of this kind of thing. Is it me or is there more of a spark between Jessica and Matt than between her and Luke? Not that either of them should be in a relationship; just something I noticed. The Chinese restaurant episode was easily the best of the series. And it wasn't limited to the main characters: I wanted to see more of Trish and Karen together, two journalists working the same case from another angle. Misty got shortchanged with a weak subplot (the cops who don't believe the heroes are always such a tiresome cliche in stories like this), but she's positioned for better material in the future. I was surprised how little Claire got to do, given that she's been the connection between these shows until now.

I also appreciated the world-building that went into this from the beginning. Daredevil season 1 had a subplot about Nelson & Murdock defending tenants of an apartment complex that is being demolished to become an office building. Daredevil season 2 revealed that same construction site to have a giant hole leading so far underground that Matt couldn't sense the bottom. Defenders shows not just the finished building but the nature of the hole in the ground. The braintrust behind these shows clearly had a long-term plan.

My hopes for future Marvel/Netflix shows:
- Please, please, no more Hand. Three seasons is enough already. We need new villains.
- Explain Matt's survival in a way that confirms Elektra and Gao's death. I want closure, confirmation that we're done with them.
- As terrific as Vincent D'Onofrio is, go easy on the Kingpin. Don't drive him into the ground through overuse like the Hand.
- Have more crossovers between shows, now that the characters know each other.
- Cross over with the damn movies already! What's the point of a shared MCU if there's no sharing?
- Do a second Defenders series that leans on Luke/Jessica this time, so that Matt/Danny feel peripheral for a change.
- Fix Danny Rand. He's the worst.

If I had to give each show a rating on a scale from 1-10:
Daredevil S1: 6
Jessica Jones: 8
Daredevil S2: 4
Luke Cage: 6
Iron Fist: 3
Defenders: 7

What do you think?

Erik Bates | August 21, 2017
[hidden by request]

Scott Hardie | August 21, 2017
I hear you. It's a lot of series, and a lot of episodes at that. If they cut the episode count to 4-9 per season, they'd tell better stories that would be easier for viewers to keep up with.

Is Netflix overwhelming in general? People ask me why I don't have HBO Go or don't use my Amazon Prime account to view any shows. I feel like I can't even keep up with Netflix, let alone other services.

Evie Totty | August 22, 2017
First - let me address the number of Marvel shows Netflix is throwing at you :)

They are contracted to show only 2 series per year. Yep - that's how long they've been running because that's where we are at. Defenders was to be the last for this year but The Punisher - a show that wasn't supposed to be a show - is now an exception and will be the third later this year.

Danny Rand/Iron Fist THE WORST OMG THE WORST. I have no idea why they messed up Iron Fist this badly but they did. AGAIN - Colleen is a greater badass than Danny.

The Hand: I was tired of The Hand at the end of Daredevil S2 to be honest. I even split my opinion of that season based on the first and second halves. S2.1 is the best of the Netflix MCU and S2.2 is second worst (with Iron Fist being the absolute worst and I don't see that ever changing - unless they do another crappy Iron Fist.)

The martial arts: I Laughed Out Loud when Jessica was like 'am I the only one in the world who doesn't know karate?' or something like that. And I don't blame her! Though I admit I actually LOOKED for signs of choreography during that last sequence when they were all fighting and the camera panned.

A small complaint - not ONE utterance of 'Sweet Christmas!' (but one 'Sweet Sister')

Otherwise I honestly can't give a real opinion. I literally set an alarm for 3 AM ET so I could get up and watch The Defenders (because Netflix goes by PT) and had it done by 5 PM the next day (darn job!). At the end I was like 'What did I just watch?' So either I hated it or I was just too sleepy. I feel like I need to watch it again...

Denise Sawicki | August 22, 2017
I have not seen it yet but have seen all the other Marvel shows on Netflix. I know I'm in the minority but I for some reason found 2nd season Daredevil more fun than 1st season, otherwise I generally agree with Scott's rankings :). One thing that may help with the unintelligible action sequences is turning on the "audio description for the blind". I use this a lot.

Scott Hardie | August 24, 2017
The Hand are lousy villains in general. I have heard that they were so unpopular in the eighties that Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles was created to parodize them (primarily via "The Foot Clan"), and that sounds about right. In Daredevil's second season, the Hand were a nebulous, omnipotent villain who were always suddenly able to do whatever the script needed them to do at any given time, and that lack of specificity made them boring. In Iron Fist, they again waxed and waned in power: in one episode, they knew instantly that Harold Meachum left his penthouse, but in another, they couldn't even tell that Harold had murdered and disposed of two of their minions. They were like a broken record, but then, so was everything in that show. In The Defenders, the Hand got more interesting when they were finally whittled down to just the five fingers, gaining names and faces and personalities, not to mention mortal weakness without their "substance" (how tiresome that word became). This team-up show almost managed to make them interesting, so kudos on that. But really, enough with the Hand already; Marvel has tons of other more interesting villains. (Bullseye and Typhoid Mary have yet to appear, to name two of the biggest.)

Great suggestion on the audio description, Denise. Some of these fight scenes, like the opening scene of The Defenders which takes place between unnamed combatants in near-total darkness, are just impossible to follow. I'm really tired of seeing one stuntman in silhouette punching another stuntman in silhouette -- which is another reason why I want these shows to get away from all the damn kung-fu and explore other kinds of action sequences.