Police Brutality Has a New Name: "Hot Springs"

Tony Peters | June 27, 2007
This story has gotten a lot of press in the skatebord world especially with the probable inclusion of skateboarding in the London 2012 Olympics. It seems the the not so good Officer Williams doesn't seem to understand the meaning of controled use of force. This thing has people in europe are talking about it because the Slalom Skateboarding World championships are in North Carolina this fall (lots of older more responsible skateboarders there). in general I know that the youngins involved were breaking the local ordinance but the extreme reaction by the officer is scary

EDIT thank you Lori

Lori Lancaster | June 27, 2007
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Steve Dunn | June 28, 2007
I watched the first segment. What's the big deal? Do the cops beat the crap out of someone in the later segments? I feel like I must be missing something.

Tony Peters | June 28, 2007
the big deal is that for the act of violating an ordinance (like not picking up after your dog) the first guy was choke slammed, and two others were grabbed around the neck and wrestled to the ground. Most states ban any and all contact with the neck by LEO's to avoid injury to the accused and lawsuits because of deaths that occur from what can appear to be minor contact. Theatening the use of MACE (on a child no less) isn't a whole lot better either, this is actually a felony in most states, you either do it or you don't but you don't threaten. The improper use of force in this case is a sad example of what happens when people with the wrong temperment are placed in a position of power. The entire time this officer was the person who escalated the issue He went so far as to handcuff a kid on the edge of the sidewalk and then abondonhim on the ground (another no-no) as soo as a suspect is in handcuffs he is your responsiblity. Anything that happens to him/her is the fault of the person who placed him in cuffs. The fact that the internet and has brought this to international attention is truely amazing to me. I wrote a letter of Protest and Boycot to the mayor of Hotsprings, I had planned on doing a trip south when I retire in two years but after seeing this I will avoid Arkansas completely.
Steve, the segments were broken up to show all of what the kid taped because there was some discussion about the fact that the tape was edited on various skateboard bulletin boards.

Lori Lancaster | June 28, 2007
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Erik Bates | June 28, 2007
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Tony Peters | June 28, 2007
Oh I agree the kids were in the wrong but an ordinance is not law, there is no such thing as Felony Skateboarding, though I have dodged Felony Trespassing on numerous occasions.
Would a police officer be in the wrong for choking a dog owner who refused to pick up crap? How about handcuffing someone for putting up a lost dog sign and threatening to mace them? I was given the responsiblity of doing Use of Force training for 60 odd people onboard my ship and looking at this incident from that POV it is all I can do not to scream in frustration at the the number of mistakes the LEO made.

Scott Hardie | June 29, 2007
Let's be clear: Only the boy in the red shirt was arrested "for skateboarding," and the cop didn't use force on him. The boy in the green shirt and the girl were forcibly detained for fleeing and resisting arrest, and the boy in the white shirt was forcibly detained for interfering with a law enforcement officer and resisting arrest. At no time was violent force used against kids "for skateboarding." That the kids kept saying that it was, despite the officer's repeated explanations to the contrary (see 3:30 in part two), is a sign that they're not very bright kids. The skateboarding culture has long had a chip on its shoulder about police, over plenty of legitimate transgressions I'm sure, but this isn't one of them. The cop was correct to use force.

That said, I don't know if his chosen methods of force (chokeholds and threatening to use mace) or his temporary abandonment of the cuffed kid or his delay in reading them their rights (presumably it happened before going to the precinct) or even his arresting someone for skateboarding were appropriate. I'm just saying, these kids didn't get what they got for skateboarding. They got it for fleeing, interference, and resisting arrest.

Tony, any idea what happened to the kids after this? My guess is, charges were dropped. The boy in the red shirt was peaceful, and the boy in the white shirt was merely walking up and talking angrily at the cop (didn't really intend to get physical), and who knows about the boy in the green shirt. The only one I want to see charges pressed against is the one who got away, the girl, because she's the only one who is clearly visible breaking the law in the video. (Hint: We don't see her skateboarding.)

Steve Dunn | June 29, 2007
Oh OK, some skateboard kids got momentarily harassed by a redneck cop while acting like jackasses. Cry me a river.

There's enough real police brutality in the world that getting distracted by this stuff just takes our eyes off the ball. Those kids are fine. Meanwhile, there are thousands of innocent people rotting away in prison and death row. Without skateboards. Without camcorders.

Tony Peters | June 29, 2007
Scott the first kid that you see in the video was actually Choke slammed it just wasn't caught on video. There is a photo of the Officer siting on top of the kid on the ground with at least one hand on the kids throat holding him down. From what I have read two of the kids were placed on "house" arrest because it's there second offence of "Skateboarding" The Police and the DA were standing behind the officers arests even if his actions were suspect
Fleeing a police officer who feels that you have broken the law for not picking up dog crap or jaywalking is resisting arrest??? We are talking about a local ordinance here which as far as I know means misdemeanor at the very harshest, where as those kids were treated like they had commited a felony, this is less on an issue than a speeding ticket.
Why it this realy that important to me? Well I skateboard even at age 40, I've been known to hop on a distance board and skate 10-15 miles for exercise, like some people ride a bike Right now I spend 2-3 hours a day running slalom cones in the parking lot of my motel again just for exercise. The funny thing is under my state law Skateboards share the same rights as other "Toys"...bikes included which means that "local" ordinances to restrict their use as "transportation" have no standing but that doesn't stop police officers from bothering me everyonce in a while...Strangely I heard of a successful challenge to anti skating ordinances using the "alternative transportation" sections of the Clean Air Act which is creative in my opinion. Now I'm an adult and member of the military, which in truth is quite a good get out of silly infractions card as anything else, so I get out of trouble but I know that someone 20 years my junior would not get the same treatment.

Scott Hardie | June 30, 2007
Fleeing is not resisting arrest. Physically scuffling with an officer who is attempting to detain you, regardless of the degree of your infraction, *is* resisting arrest, and yes I know it's a natural reaction to being grabbed like that and I'd probably have done it myself. Note that the kid in the red shirt, who stopped when the cop told him to and did not have any physical altercation with the cop, was not charged with either fleeing or resisting arrest.

There are enough real abuses by cops against skateboarders that we don't need to call this incident what it isn't. I still believe this cop was correct in his actions even if he was too hostile in his attitude.

Tony Peters | July 1, 2007
Stopping them yes they were acting in a manner contrary to local ordinance but the officer's actions were actually more illegal (at least in the jurisdictions that I have worked and lived) than the youths he was apprehending. I was taught that when you grab someone around the throat to detain them you are are in the wrong, it is a natural human response to react in a negative manner and as such not punishable. It is an escalation of force that produces more problems than it solves and as such it banned from use in many jurisdiction (this is to say nothing of the medical problems it can cause). I say this from many years of personal experience as a use of force trainer and cuffing dummy with a number of different state and federal agencies. As it turns out had those children been on the other side of the street they would have been in federal jurisdiction and again in the wrong but of a federal statute, you can guaranty that they would have been detained in a manner more in keeping with their civil rights.

Jackie Mason | July 1, 2007
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Scott Hardie | February 14, 2008
Another controversy erupts: (link) This cop clearly has issues.

Tony Peters | February 14, 2008
Scott, I knew you were posting about Baltimore as soon as I saw the thread come up. This just came to light although it happened last summer. the officer in question was suspended pending an investigation. The story behind why he was pissed at the youth was the kid had his Ipod on and didn't hear the command to stop skateboarding. Officer Rivieri seemed not to care about much except mouthing off which is why he's in trouble