Scott Hardie | November 1, 2004
The new site is launched. Details are available on the Goo Reborn page:

(link)

Please mention any errors you find here in this discussion, so that other users don't bother mentioning what someone else has already found, and I'll fix them as fast as I can. Thanks.

Comments are appreciated. I hate to launch a site with a few missing pages, especially when I'm so close to finishing them, but this monkey has been on my back for six months and I was determined to keep the deadline no matter what.

Scott Hardie | November 1, 2004
And a special note for regular TC authors, since it's easy to miss: Your point of interest is the "Current Discussions" page. You can find it at the bottom of the TC menu. Once you have finished reading and replying for the moment, click the "I've Read Everything" link. This will create a link in the upper-right corner whenever there are new comments (which, obviously, will take at least a few minutes to appear), and that link will be your fast route back to the Current Discussions page.

In other words, I redesigned TC to make it a lot easier for you to access new content, but only if you know where to click.

Scott Hardie | November 1, 2004
Also: I'm open to requests if there's something you want to have working right away. As far as I'm concerned, the two top priorities are an "edit" link here in TC discussions so we can fix our typos, and the FIN post page, so I can put up a new post this weekend. (Damn I miss that game.)

Scott Horowitz | November 1, 2004
Just looking around Scott, must say good job. One gripe I have is that the colors on TC make the text hard to read... white text on a light grey background. Maybe it's just me

Erik Bates | November 1, 2004
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Mike Eberhart | November 1, 2004
Excellent re-design of the site Scott. Also, I like the new scoring system for the Goo game. I really think that one will work great.


Good Job...

Scott Horowitz | November 1, 2004
Now I'm seeing black... odd. It came in as white text for me for a while, now I am seeing black. Maybe was having some firefox trouble?

Scott Hardie | November 1, 2004
Just browser caching, I guess, unless others report it too. The text is supposed to be black everywhere.

Thanks for the kind words so far!

I'm off for a long day at work, so I probably won't respond to messages until late tonight, but please don't let that stop you. :-)

Anna Gregoline | November 1, 2004
Is there still stuff being worked out - the site right now is so. slow.

I'm not trying to be a wet blanket, just saying how I feel - and right now I'm very bummed out about the new site. I'm sure I'll get used to it, but right now, it's a very despairing Monday.

Todd Brotsch | November 1, 2004
Hey Hey, Now that I reset my cache things are looking better....was going crazy for a while, so you can imagine how that is.

Anywho....How/Where do you look to see the goo towers?


Latta

Mike Eberhart | November 1, 2004
There aren't anymore goo towers. Now you have to fill in a grid of 100 squares. Much better scoring system I believe...

Todd Brotsch | November 1, 2004
Right, but how do you view this?

Scott Horowitz | November 1, 2004
With your eyes, geeze Todd... come on!

hehehe, (link)

it's at the bottom of the goo menu page.

Todd Brotsch | November 1, 2004
ooo, thank you kindly...was looking for it in the realtivly same place it was before. ty Scott

Todd Brotsch | November 1, 2004
It's going to take forever to win this thing.

Scott Horowitz | November 1, 2004
Not up for the challenge, Todd? Why don't you concede now then? Realisticially with 7 goos a week, in theory it could take 100 days minimum. which is 3 months roughly. The last system was 15 weeks minimum which again is about 3 months, so it's not that much different.

Todd Brotsch | November 1, 2004
yeah, I had thought about it more after I posted...since I can't edit or retract at the moment,...(j/k)

Fifteen goos not including the tie brakers was 105 days, (+ obviously)

There will be no concession speeches until my lawyers are totally satisfied.

Mike Eberhart | November 1, 2004
Oh, and Scott, I really like that you find out instantly if your answer is right or not. Definately something that this game has been needing for sometime. Excellent addition.

Oh and Anna, I also have been experiencing the slowness with the site. Nothing too serious though.

Anna Gregoline | November 1, 2004
No, not too serious, just a little lag-time. Probably still waiting for some full-implementation thingy from Scott.

Bizarrely - I don't like the text being so wide! But that's my problem because I don't read TC in full-screen mode.

Todd Brotsch | November 1, 2004
I'm not noticing any speed issues here, if that helps at all.....

Denise Sawicki | November 1, 2004
I have speed issues too, in fact that prototype you showed me a while ago, Scott, seemed a lot faster with the image loading and stuff... I guess I could be imagining things though.

Lori Lancaster | November 1, 2004
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Anthony Lewis | November 1, 2004
I think I may have to view the site using IE. I've been using Mozilla Firefox for the last few months, but the text comes out white. This site is better with IE.

Scott Horowitz | November 1, 2004
Anthony, clear your firefox cache and then it works fine.

Anthony Lewis | November 1, 2004
Thank you Boss. It worked.

Scott Horowitz | November 1, 2004
One thing I miss, is that it no longer has a count of your TC posts :(

Anna Gregoline | November 1, 2004
I know, I liked seeing where everyone was. =(

I think Scott just didn't want to watch me pass him. I was oh so close though. =)

Amy Austin | November 1, 2004
Since I commented elsewhere before seeing this thread, I figured I'd just re-post a frag here:

Okay, how did you suddenly become a question mark, Jackie -- I know I saw the new pic elsewhere! (BTW, I thought that your "witchy" picture was cute... and I was right about your "bangs" the first time... they *were* feathers!!!) This is a little bit weird, seeing everyone up a little bit closer... but it is easier to read with bigger font and no cute yellow background with flowers (I did like, but hard to read with white on top!)

I, too, had some speed issues... but I can never tell what to attribute *that* to, since there seems to always be some frickin' adware/spyware compromising my computer's efforts... I keep trying things like Webroot and SpyBlaster, but it seems that you have to pay in order to really stay on top of that crap, which really pisses me off... but that's another topic!

Guys, there's still a count -- it's in the TC Intro page... and you're still right behind Scott, Anna.

John E Gunter | November 1, 2004
Nice looking new site Scott. Course, I'm waiting for the group calendar re-write myself. :-)

John

Anthony Lewis | November 1, 2004
So my stats are gone? Aw man!

Oh well, if I cracked the top ten, I wouldn't be there for long. Amy has been a posting machine since she's been here.

Anna Gregoline | November 1, 2004
Nope, your stats aren't gone. They're in the TC Intro page.

Anthony Lewis | November 1, 2004
Yeah, I see.

Something else I see. Steve Dunn and Steve West look like they could be brothers.

Hmmmmm.

Scott Hardie | November 1, 2004
White text: It sounds like a recurring problem for Firefox users, and I'm glad clearing the cache solves it. I didn't realize it was going to happen; I don't use Firefox enough to have a cache of the old site. Glad this one worked itself out.

Slowness: Beats me. It loads fine for me, only a little slower than the previous site, because it has to instantiate a lot of classes I wasn't using before (programming stuff). Very long pages (like the Yankees discussion) take a long time to generate, which is one reason why I intend to let you break TC discussions down into smaller pages in a future update. But small pages, like the site menu, should load in under six seconds for anyone with broadband, and under 20 seconds for anyone on dial-up. Is this not the case? Anyway, there are a few pages missing, but there's nothing else yet to be added to the pages that do exist; they're loading like they should.

Scoring system: Sounds like you guys figured it out. I notice several people have given themselves Grid Control already, the same ones who are putting the first goo in A1, pretty much.

Author counts: Like Amy & Anna said, the counts are still there, in the Statistics section of the TC Introduction page ((link) ). Click on either "list" link to see a pyramid format of the authors; I fully expect to see Anna claim the top of the pyramid in the next two weeks and keep it. :-)

Jackie's missing icon: That was a mistake; I think it's resolved now.

Steve and Steve: Uhhh... Are you just kidding around, or do you really see the same icon for both users? Don't joke with a man trying to fix a lot of glitches at once. ;-)

Scott Hardie | November 1, 2004
Also: Thanks again for the compliments and constructive criticism. I appreciate it.

One user mentioned in email that the login box doesn't use a password format (concealing the text as you type it in), but that's by design. I've never cared for those damn things; I prefer to see what I type. Does anybody else have an opinion? I'll make it a password-type field if that's what the people want.

Erik Bates | November 2, 2004
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Jackie Mason | November 2, 2004
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Jackie Mason | November 2, 2004
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Scott Horowitz | November 2, 2004
Just one thing I'd like to suggest... you have the images at top talking about past things, and some seem interesting to look at. Maybe make them links to the discussion/goo?

Oh, and not that I played in it, but what happened to TWC?

Kris Weberg | November 2, 2004
While I suppose it's possible for someone to "hijack" an identity here, I think we all know each other too well for that one to work.

Scott Hardie | November 2, 2004
I also like the slideshow of memorable former content. I wanted to incorporate large header images into the site, yet when I tried to find one central image for each section, I kept wrestling with different ideas. When I decided to randomly shuffle them, it was easy to take the next step and make lots and lots of them. There are about 300 in the system, with lots more coming this January I'm sure. FIN needs 'em most.

I've also thought about making them links, but the Javascript doesn't work that way. I could turn the whole thing into one link, but not one that would shift to a different destination per picture, at least as far as I can brainstorm.

The slideshow technically doesn't even work correctly in Firefox, so there's another thing you guys are missing. IE does a smooth transition between images, while Firefox just shifts one to the next instantly. Oh well; the slideshow doesn't even work at all in Opera.

TWC ended in October, though some might say it was over a lot sooner. I plan to start another role-playing game with friends next spring, and there will be a new section on the site to accommodate it.

Another thing about the slideshow: One of the things I'm proud of is how much significant content came from other users. Only two of TC's ten longest discussions were started by me, and both of those are already appearing in the rotation, so 2004's additions will be mostly instigated by users. Thank you for your contributions.

Anthony Lewis | November 2, 2004
I'm serious Scott. Look at their pictures. They look like they could be brothers.

Scott Hardie | November 2, 2004
I just don't see it, Anthony. Those guys are as white as I am.

Lori Lancaster | November 2, 2004
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Anthony Lewis | November 2, 2004
LOLOLOL. That one almost went over my head. Good one, Scott.

Jackie Mason | November 2, 2004
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Scott Horowitz | November 2, 2004
Wow... I just saw that I hit the 300 mark in TC. Watch out Anna and Scott. I'm gonna catch up. hehehehe... this just proves that I have too little to do at work.

Scott Hardie | November 2, 2004
Recents will be back after a while. I have plans for them.

Steve West | November 3, 2004
It's true - about my whiteness I mean. I'm just a white guy trapped inside the body of an even whiter guy. It's sad really.

Scott Horowitz | November 3, 2004
About the link text, can you make it display the link instead of (Iink), just an opinion of mine.

Scott Hardie | November 3, 2004
I did it that way at first, but with the text being justified now, it screwed up a lot of paragraphs to have super-long links in there. I suppose I could make it an option that each user sets personally.

Scott Hardie | November 3, 2004
The "edit a comment" page is now done. You should see an "edit" link on the byline for any comment you wrote in the last month. One of the best improvements in this site upgrade (imo) is that the formatting I do to your comment is now done when the comment is displayed, not when the comment is sent to the database like before. Thus, your comment stays in the database exactly as you wrote it, which means you can edit it without any of my HTML junk getting in the way.

Amy Austin | November 3, 2004
"...I'm just a white guy trapped inside the body of an even whiter guy..."

So what you're saying, Steve, is that there *is* a hint of color inside there somewhere...? ;D

Todd Brotsch | November 3, 2004
Thank the maker!! An edit feature!!! Fantastic!!

Lori Lancaster | November 3, 2004
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Mike Eberhart | November 4, 2004
Scott, just a quick question. When will we be able to edit our information on the site?

Scott Hardie | November 4, 2004
I can get that done soon if you'd like. I don't think it's right that there's old information being displayed about you and you can't change/remove it; it's just that there are other things I'm treating as higher priorities at the moment.

Mike Eberhart | November 4, 2004
There's no rush, just curious.

Scott Hardie | November 4, 2004
What about speed issues? I need some help with this one, because the site loads lickety-split for me, except for those really long TC discussions. When you click a link:

Does it take forever for the browser to react? That's a server issue; it isn't delivering the page fast enough.

Does it react quickly, but take forever before the gray table at the top of the page loads? That's a Javascript issue; it's slow to initialize that code.

Does it load the gray table quickly, then take forever to load the rest of the page? Then it's a PHP issue.

The best test is whether you can get to simple pages quickly. How about, say, the Goo Rules page (link) – how long does that page take to load, from the moment you click the link? It takes me a little over a second. I chose that page because it doesn't have any other code processing on it than the basic Javascript stuff in the header that all of the other pages also have.

I have taken two steps just now to increase the speed: First, I removed the image preloading from the Javascript, which will shave off a little bit of time and isn't really necessary. Second, I increased the image compression on everybody's user icons, because they load so often – no matter what page you're on, you'll always see yours in the upper-right corner, for instance. I'm not so sure I like this change, as there are little differences now, like no gap between Mike's teeth and the shiny reflection mostly gone from Scott Horowitz's face, and now John Gunter looks like he has a skin condition. I might undo this change, I dunno; the average user icon was 22k before and is 4k now.

Amy Austin | November 4, 2004
I have noticed an increase in speed lately (and I did notice that more blurbage naturally takes longer, too -- I can deal)... so whatever you're doing must be working for me!

John E Gunter | November 4, 2004
The page load times have dropped quite a bit. I'm guessing either through the browsers finally caching the new site or there was an issue with your hosting companies servers. I've noticed I get flaky results on my site sometimes and then start looking at the code trying to figure it out.

Even to the point of changing code, then all of a sudden things start working again. One thing I've noticed is if my site begins to behave strange, example being nothing being returned from the database calls, I close all of my browsers, open a new one and go to the site. So far that has corrected all weirdness.

But for speed problems, it's usually my hosting company that is causing the delay.

John

Anna Gregoline | November 4, 2004
It DOES seem faster today, so something must be better.

Mike Eberhart | November 4, 2004
Scott, just another suggestion. I don't know if it can be done or not, but maybe you could put a "Reply" button or link that shows on everyone's comments so if your reading a thread and you want to reply right at that point you can, instead of having to scroll all the way to the end before replying. Anyway, just a thought.

Jackie Mason | November 5, 2004
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Mike Eberhart | November 5, 2004
Go out to the main TC page, and at the bottom there's a link to start a new discussion.

Jackie Mason | November 5, 2004
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Scott Horowitz | November 5, 2004
Hey Scott, Can you add a "Start Discussion" Link on the current discussions page. It would make navigating a little quicker? Maybe near the "I've read everything" link.

Todd Brotsch | November 5, 2004
Suck it up cupcake, it's on the TC front page.

Scott Horowitz | November 5, 2004
Laugh it up, fuzzball!

Todd Brotsch | November 5, 2004
You want a kiss? Is that what you're going for?

It's not wise to upset a wookie

Amy Austin | November 5, 2004
You guys sound like *you're* married sometimes!

Scott Horowitz | November 5, 2004
The sad part is that we've never even met IRL. But, at least, Mitzman wasn't my boss !!!

Todd Brotsch | November 5, 2004
You're idea of mitzman serving in a supervisory position of anyone is laughable.

Amy Austin | November 5, 2004
I didn't think you had, but you definitely talk like it -- weirdoes!

Scott Hardie | November 6, 2004
Thanks for the suggestions; I've added them to the list.

I've had my computer off for two days, and when I turned it back on, my browser cache was empty and my cookies were gone. (Anti-spyware programs found nothing wrong.) So I came here to the site, and holy shit you guys weren't kidding about it being slow. It seems to have picked up considerably after using it for 30-60 minutes, but that's crazy time, waiting sixty seconds for a page to load fully. There's no way that's my PHP code; the PHP is done running as soon as you see all the text on the screen. What's slow to load are the images, one at a time, which makes me think it's a server issue, possibly server overload. I'm going to monitor it for a few days, and backup the database just in case; we don't need to start another GOO round over again from scratch in its second week.

Erik Bates | November 6, 2004
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Scott Hardie | November 6, 2004
Now I'm convinced it's a server issue. I've spent the last hour editing stuff in my administrator account and the database itself, stuff that has nothing at all to do with there being a new site now, and it's processing at a snail's pace; this stuff should have taken me twenty minutes. I'll see what can be done.

Amy Austin | November 6, 2004
I was all fine and well until tonight -- things appear to have slowed WAY the fuck down again... but that's not to say that it couldn't be server/something else.

Scott Hardie | November 7, 2004
My web host says the server issues have been fixed, and everything seems fine to me. Still getting slow-down?

Now finished: The FIN story archive for 2003 (link) and 2004 (link) as well as the page for each post and the "edit a reply" form. I'm going to start a new post now; hopefully I'll finish in one day.

Amy Austin | November 7, 2004
All good again... lickety-splickety.

Denise Sawicki | November 9, 2004
Hey Scott, more things to bother you with :) I kind of wanted my user info public, or at least my web site link, because for some reason one can no longer find my actual web site through google. :P This way long lost acquaintances could find me if they so desired for some reason...

Todd Brotsch | November 10, 2004
'Nother idea for ya Hauss. When a goo is completed can you put up then incorrect guesses (if there were any) for that person? Not who made them, just the incorrect guesses.

I think it'd be cool to see what others were thinking

T

Scott Horowitz | November 10, 2004
Maybe even post a snide remark for "worst guess made?"

David Mitzman | November 10, 2004
Maybe make it a bit easier to navigate to the scores page? Can't easily get to it from current goos page.

Scott Hardie | November 11, 2004
Denise: I'm surprised. For the year I had the site, I checked every once in a while to see if anybody else besides me had publicized their personal info, and I swear I never saw anybody else using that feature, so I made the personal info accessible by login only. Either you just changed your mind this month or my database queries suck. :-) I'll add that to the list.

Todd: I often do this already, if I find the answers interesting. (link) (link) But too often, they're boring, especially for lesser-known celebs. (link) (link) I am wary of publishing incorrect guesses all the time because I fear it would intimidate players into not guessing unless they're certain, but I might give a chance, maybe something you could activate in your GOO options ("always let my incorrect guesses be seen"). How many other people want this?

Dave: I was wondering when someone was going to request that. The scores link is intentionally hard to find because I wanted to de-emphasize competition; the majority of players should be concerned only with guessing at the current goos. But, I think I'll add a link to the scores page to the dynamic navigation, to be activated in your GOO options. I'll add it to the list.

Denise Sawicki | November 11, 2004
Well I had changed it around and turned it public on the old site but one time I looked back and saw it was changed back the way it was before and turned private, so I changed it to public again... This might have been when your server crashed or whatever. It might not have actually been public for very long.

Erik Bates | November 11, 2004
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Amy Austin | November 11, 2004
I like seeing the incorrect guesses, too -- I just think it's interesting to see how creative or close or far-off one might be if they're stumped (or too lazy to dig). It probably would be a nice addition to make it a voluntary thing, though, as you suggest... that should please everybody!

Steve Dunn | November 11, 2004
For the one I missed, I guessed Vlad the Impaler. FYI.

My hyper-competitiveness on the goo game is a thing of the past because I'm about to go on vacation and be away from the internet for over a week. Since I could not possibly keep up with the leaders anyway, I feel a sudden sense of liberation. I am free! I am no longer a slave to the goo game!!

I SHOULD be happy, I know, but really I'm not. Scott's a hell of a guy, but all this anti-competiveness stuff makes me nauseous. More competition, I say!! To the death!! To the pain!!

Being as ultra-competitive as I am, it pains me that I have never won the goo game. And now it takes 100 goos to win? With the amount of time I spend traveling without internet access, I think my chances have diminished almost to zero.

Scott Hardie | November 12, 2004
You're certainly not the only one, Steve. :-) I programmed two site menus, one for registered users and one for strangers. Maybe I should program two Celebrity Goo Games, one that emphasizes the fun of guessing and one that emphasizes the competition? Anyway, John Pierpoint requested that his grid be visible on the current goos page to aid in his choosing a space, and I think I'm going to program a GOO option to handle that.

Erik: Fixed.

Amy Austin | November 12, 2004
Crap. I'm hearin' ya', Steve -- I, too, am a fierce competitor... and I'm getting ready to move/drive cross-country next week!!! (E's glad to have his laptop back to himself, too.) It's going to be hard for me to get in any guesses before December, probably, unless I manage to do so at my folks' house in VA!!! Geez...

Steve Dunn | November 12, 2004
OK, this is it. I'm out. I'm gone. See you around 11/20.

Beer and wings on me in Barbados!!! You coming this time, Anthony?

Lori Lancaster | November 12, 2004
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Erik Bates | November 12, 2004
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Anna Gregoline | November 12, 2004
Yeah, I was wondering that myself. Have I been saying it wrong always? Has everyone? I've never heard it pronounced any way but one.

Lori Lancaster | November 12, 2004
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Scott Horowitz | November 15, 2004
Just noticing that I've been having some trouble with the images on the site. The goo last night wouldn't show for quite a few minutes. (It came up as a broken image.)

Scott Hardie | November 16, 2004
That was my fault. I created another batch of goos, and input all of their information into the database, but forgot to upload the images. :-) I'm just glad I was still awake at the time; I often go to bed before midnight and don't go on the computer in the morning, so it could have been as late as now before I got the image online.

Scott Hardie | November 17, 2004
Added today: "Extended Navigation" for each of the four site sections, plus Help and Control Panel. This will resolve many of the requests for certain links (like Current Scores or Start a Discussion) to appear at the top of the page. Links are provided in what I consider to be descending order of importance.

Visit your Control Panel to activate them, one site section at a time: (link)

Steve West | November 17, 2004
I was flipping through the control panel (nice) and under current scores for the goo game, the page I see is almost blank.

Scott Hardie | November 17, 2004
It's fixed. As one of many minor adjustments I've been making around the site lately, I altered the Current Scores page to show only players who have been active within the past month, but there was a typo in my code. Thanks for pointing it out, Steve; the typo didn't affect my view, so I wouldn't have caught it on my own.

If anybody worries about an author posting a new comment between the moment when they load the Current Discussions page and the moment when they click the "I've Read Everything" link (not an unreasonable fear with the frequent posting some days), I made another adjustment today: The link is now based on the last comment when the page was loaded, not the last comment at all. Thus, every once in a while, you'll click the link but there will still be a new comment afterwards.

Scott Hardie | November 18, 2004
As requested by Mike (and others by email): You can now edit your personal info, as well as your name and password, in your Control Panel.

As requested by Scott: A "nicknames" field has been added.

As requested by Denise: You can now choose to publicize your personal info so that anyone can see it.

Scott Hardie | November 19, 2004
On the Current Scores page, I have added a gray "X" wherever there used to be a goo but it has been eliminated by an incorrect guess. I added that partly in case players wonder what happened to the goos they knew were there, and partly to show that some players have guessed correctly more often than their grid would indicate.

Scott Hardie | November 19, 2004
As requested by John Pierpoint: You now have an option to "Show Grid" in the GOO section of your Control Panel. Activate this to display your grid at the top of the Current Goos page. It's useful for those of you playing with Grid Control.

Steve West | November 22, 2004
It's awful quiet in here.
Yeah, too quiet...creepy quiet.
Is this some demented sociological experiment being conducted by the evil Dr. Hardie?
If it is, let it be noted that I was the first to cry "Uncle".

Todd Brotsch | November 22, 2004
HAN SHOT FIRST!!!!

Scott Hardie | November 22, 2004
Uhhh... Hmmm... Time for an informal poll.

Lori Lancaster | November 22, 2004
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Todd Brotsch | November 25, 2004
Hey Scott.....any idea when the goo library will be back up? I ask because it helps in the search for the right answer, being that you don't repeat goos.

Thanks

Scott Hardie | November 25, 2004
I miss it too. I'm planning to put it back up this weekend, along with the Guess Again section. The Awards will take longer because they have to be integrated with the user page and certain elements already in the database.

Scott Hardie | November 25, 2004
Heads-up for GOO players: If you have a pending guess in the system, all of your correct guesses will be marked pending. This is a safety measure to make sure I don't screw up your grid: If you guess incorrectly in space A1, then five minutes later you guess correctly in space A2, I don't want to come to the site later that day and make your first guess wrong and wipe out space A2. I've had to make manual adjustments thus far to account for that, but this gives me an easy way around it, and since you're still told when you're definitely correct, it should be only a minor inconvenience for you.

Scott Hardie | November 29, 2004
At John Pierpoint's request, I have created an Updates page (link) that records all additions and improvements to the site in one convenient location. I'll still mention them here if there's a particular reason.

Todd: I didn't get the Goo Library done this weekend like I'd hoped, but I did add to the placeholder page (link) a list of all goos published to date, so at least it can serve that basic function till I get the rest of it done.

Todd Brotsch | November 29, 2004
Cool, thanks. Take some me time every now and again. You do too much with the site for us worthless ingrates.

look out for numbah one.

Life moves pretty fast....

Scott Hardie | November 30, 2004
Oh, I do. That's why I didn't get the Library done. ;-) But I appreciate the sentiment.


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